the "problem of good"

The theist must rise to the challenge, to be sure. One argument, known as the free will defense, claims that evil is caused not by God but by human beings, who must be allowed to choose evil if they are to have free will. How can a loving and all-powerful God allow so much evil and suffering? . I thoroughly disagree, as argued. (what he called the Tao). Of course, this is why societies construct legal systems, which hold that certain behaviors are wrong, and therefore, punishable by law. Do such moral non-Christians really need the gospel, or will their good deeds save them… DA is honest when he says, “Christians believe that God put this inherent sense in all human beings, so that they instinctively have a moral compass, and therefore largely agree on right and wrong in the main”. But this is false. On a May evening in 1991, after the indie rock band the Manic Street Preachers had played a gig at the Norwich Arts Centre and during an interview with New Musical Expres.(NM.) The atheist who challenges Christianity by asking how God can exist in a world with evil faces a bigger problem than the theist. Returning to your “immoral atheist” story, you are right about one thing: if the kind atheist says to the immoral atheist, “I don’t like your unkindness!” that might not register/affect the immoral atheist. Atheists do actually value things. In religious debate, much is made of the “problem of evil;” that is, if god is good, then why is there so much evil in the world. Those who believe in a God in Whom right and wrong and love are grounded, do possess such a system (especially if that God in fact exists!). Whereas of course, the theist hasn’t shown that rapists (mean people) probably are for the greater good (and thus allowed by a perfect in all ways being). His words will be in blue. What if one could promise eternal life to others and guarantee the promise by rising from the dead himself? The problem of good is not defined (as far as I can see), but if the POE [problem of evil] is the argument where evil disproves a perfectly loving being, the POG seems to … I think the following statement of mine, near the beginning, serves as a definition of the [atheist] problem of good: Simply put (but I will defend this at the greatest length once we discuss particular moral questions), atheist justifications for morality (i.e., logically carried through) will always be either completely arbitrary, relativistic to the point of absurdity, or derived from axiomatic assumptions requiring no less faith than Christian ethics require. Yet … I show how atheist use is inconsistent throughout my dialogue. If the author means atheists never hope that there is such justice, that’s false. The latter presupposes that there are things that are indisputably wrong, and agreed to be so by all, as virtually self-evident. Those who desire not to rape must not rape (if they are trying to satisfy that desire to not do so).”. I’m simply stating my position on that,m since you keep bringing it up, for some odd reason. All societies, for example, have prohibitions of murder, as inherently wrong. If there were no God, they wouldn’t be there and evil would be far, far greater than it is now (and it is a huge and troubling problem now). I live in a good creation. Fr. the Problem of Good and Evil Marian T. Horvat, Ph.D. One of the greatest problems of the Harry Potter craze, as I see it, is the tremendous confusion between good and evil it is bound to generate among the youth, especially in the already-relativized ambience of our days. In other words, he has to tacitly admit that the problem of good is a problem for atheism, in order to proceed against God and theism; and that is incoherent and self-contradictory. You apply that and assume it to be true. Love. Small kids are typically selfish and want all the toys. A better phrasing would be “if God doesn’t exist, then God doesn’t stop anything”. They sometimes went door-to-door, dragging out women and even small children and violently gang-raping them. It’s obvious what it means. That remains to be shown.DA says that atheists have 5 problems: 1) Can’t really consistently define “evil” in the first place;2) Has no hope of eventual eschatological justice;3) Has no objective basis of condemning evil;4) Has no belief in a heaven of everlasting bliss;5) Has to believe in an ultimately absolutely hopeless and meaningless universe.”. My thoughts go out to the many families touched by these disastrous choices. I was saying, in effect, “you say we have a problem? They made these women suffer in the worst ways possible. You certainly believe (or act like you believe) that rape is a thing that is essentially a moral absolute in all times and places. If “objective” means something like “godly” or “supernatural” then DA is right. I know that this is exhausting to think about, so soon... My great aunt and great uncle had COVID-19. The problem of good is broken down into three components having a complete chapter devoted to each. The first is false: many atheists can easily define “evil” consistently. Evil people will be judged and sent to hell, and those who are saved by God’s grace will be allowed to enter heaven. Number 4 is true if it means this: “atheists who believe no gods exist don’t believe in a place called Heaven made by a god”. Again, the key here lies in the word eschatological, which is a fancy theological 50-cent word for “last things.” It refers to judgment after death, and specifically the Last Judgment: where the scales will be weighed and divine / cosmic justice will be applied. Which, of course, we take as evidence for original sin, or specifically, concupiscence. Beauty. If God is all powerful – omnipotent, all knowing – omniscient, and all good – omnibenevolent, how can that same God allow evil to exist and for bad things to happen to good people? And from where we stand, this is a huge problem. Or, as most people seem to have done, we can create a false narrative where we trick the mean people by saying “you’ve just GOT to be kind!” (end of story). A good creation marred by evil, but which will be healed. But nothing about that disproves atheism. This is a belief, but it isn’t knowledge: it’s not shown to be probable. What you “ought” to do (even morally!) Problem of good . DA says that 1 and 3 basically claim “atheists cannot have objective morality”. It does not. There aren’t, at least not intellectually. Good. Oceans of goodness are a problem for those bent on being negative and seeing only what is evil. Thanks! That’s why I wasn’t arguing for those things. The problem of good asks if anyone can fully explain the goodness in life without believing in God and assigning some ultimate relationship between God and goodness. There are dualist atheists, but I am unaware of any who believe in human immortality, and a blissful afterlife. What is true is that if one continues to ask questions about things we will always get to an arbitrary point (the point in which we don’t have an answer for something). Thus moral relativism of the sort described here is true/real/exists. The same way the logician and the one arguing the problem of evil does. Some of our knowledge is already like that! Of course, that is no disproof that they exist. Nothing here is “absurd” to the point of falsifying anything I’ve said. Atheists have no godly basis for condemning evil. Typically, by “evil” I am referring to actions that aren’t for the greater good, and by that I mean actions like rape (but there are others). It’s not clear from the get-go. On what absolute / objective basis do you define “kindly” and how and why would all human beings be bound to it? Goodness In man is not a mere passive quality, but the deliberate preference of right to wrong, the firm and persistent resistance of all moral evil, and the choosing and following of all moral good. It went very well, and is my very favorite dialogue of all the multiple hundreds I’ve been in. But the atheist must also take his turn offering his own explanation, and his task faces a complication the theist does not encounter. *FREE* shipping on qualifying offers. J.L. The problem of good Will not stop confronting me, Even when I want it to. The problem of Good Deeds and Faith. The problem of ... / September 1, 2017 November 1, 2019. Rather, I think it helps to establish that theism (considered as a whole) is more coherent and plausible than atheism. Friday night we will have a special Thanksgiving Praise & Communion Service. So this curious claim will have to be unpacked and elaborated upon. But if the author means, atheists typically don’t have any strong evidence for such justice, that’s true, but so too true for the theist. He is interacting with my paper, The “Problem of Good”: Great Dialogue With an Atheist (the Flip Side of the Problem of Evil Argument Against Christianity) + the Nature of Meaningfulness in Atheism. The atheist rock bottom is like peeling an onion: it’s nothing. We train most kids to be less selfish. Surely goodness and mercy shall follow me all the days of my life. Faith. It’s central to the problem of good. DA claims that the atheism will result in something that is “incoherent and morally objectionable”. Yep. Truth. Of course they do. That is, nothing about existing morality disproves atheism or proves theism. It’s obvious our creator is very clearly evil! The Problem of Good: When the World Seems Fine Without God The chief problem with accepting the existence of God is the fact that evil exists. And, as I just argued, jails and judges and laws all presuppose an absolute system of morals and right and wrong. Hope. It The theists mistake is in thinking that everyone really does have to be kind (and some atheists say this, which doesn’t help), regardless of anything. but what about the problem of good ? and that 2nd claim (“You objective ought to be kind”) is true. Photo credit: Nanjing Tribunal investigates remains of Nanjing Massacre victims (1946) [public domain / Wikimedia Commons], Please also opt me in for Exclusive Offers from Patheos’s Partners. Creation is good and the solution to the damage done by parasitic evil is not abandonment but redemption. Those who desire to be kind must be kind (if they are trying to satisfy that desire). If there is no God and there are rapes, then we live in a world that is “morally objectionable” if one means by that “frustrating to kind people”. So Dave and Mike had a discussion about theism. The invaders, though, didn’t even stop at simply murder. Thursday, September 6, 2012. Oddly, there seems to be no definition of “objective morality”. .”. I’m not denying that individual atheists have such moral / ethical standards for themselves. journalist Steve Lamacq, the band’s lyricist and rhythm guitarist Richey Edwards created one of contemporary rock music’s most infamous moments and one of its most challenging images. I’m talking about meaningful purpose here and now in our human lives. If you then say, but morality (i.e., what we value) is “arbitrary” (we could value lots of different things, and we do!) But even now the light is beginning to shine and I am surrounded by so much goodness. If we can ever get beyond these non sequiturs, maybe we’ll get somewhere. I don’t think anything absolutely disproves it (if e want to get technical). This essay, however, does not repeat those arguments but instead considers a parallel question, the Problem of Good. (But it is!) If it means “actual values”, then it’s false. THE question as to the nature of evil is by far the most important problem for philosophical, religious, and moral consideration. Nothing shows that if God doesn’t exist, atheists can’t take the word “evil” and define it consistently. Personally, I think the problem of good is (or should be) just as important, especially to Christians. The second is also false. I’ve never seen anyone come close to showing this. Please note that this post contains images of hate symbols. (To be clear, by “ought” I mean something like “is sensible/reasonable for you to do”). Its true for all materialistic atheists. Pregnant mothers were cut open and rape victims were sodomized with bamboo sticks and bayonets until they died in agony. That’s a statement of sociology (my major), not philosophy. “ What does this mean? My older words, cited from the above paper, will be in green. Yes, evil is present, but not as a thing itself. Several philosophers have argued that just as there exists a problem of evil for theists who believe in an omniscient, omnipotent and omnibenevolent being, so too is there a problem of good for anyone who believes in an omniscient, omnipotent, and omnimalevolent (or perfectly evil) being. Well, that’s what I unpack in the very lengthy dialogue. that’s again just a fact about the world. Rather, the evidence shows that we do have inherent biological tendencies (but virtually no awareness knowledge from the get go of conception), most of which are selfish! So, basically, an atheist morality is ultimately arbitrary (as is any known morality). DA then wrongly says “their behavior proves it.” That is, when atheists say “I like kindness” and say “you ought to be kind!” DA thinks this proves that God exists. . What we believe makes a difference in how we act and how we construct moral and ethical systems. DA then says, the reason that all people are bound (“ought”, are required regardless of desires…) to be kind is “because God provides the over-arching “absolute” and principle of right and wrong which allows for coherent ethics and non-arbitrary determination of good and evil.” As I’ve shown, people aren’t all bound. But what if one could defeat death? God did not spend what we call 13.75 billion years creating the universe and pronouncing it very good, only to give up on it in the end and decide it would be better for the Imago Dei beings to be transferred to a non spacio-temporal existence. DA is right that an atheist truth seeker would examine apparent shortcomings to atheism. Evil is merely a corruption of what is good, a tear in the fabric of goodness, a parasite upon the host of goodness that cannot live by itself. Those are again just the facts about the world we live in. : In the mere six weeks during which the Japanese perpetrated the Nanking Massacre starting on Dec. 13, 1937, an estimated 20,000-80,000 Chinese women were brutally raped and sexually assaulted by the invading soldiers. The word good means different things to different people. I didn’t say it did prove God (let’s not get ahead of ourselves). I will give thanks for the goodness all around me. He winds up arguing as much for God as against, by utilizing such weak arguments. God did not create this good earth only to change his mind a short time later and kick it in the garbage can. What I’m saying is that they are all ultimately arbitrary and relativistic without a God to ground them in, and that large atheist systems act in accordance with this moral relativism and/or amorality (Mao, Lenin, Stalin et al): and we see what they produced. Many atheists (at least those in power) did indeed conclude that any evil was possible in a godless universe. What an utterly terrifying “world” that is . I will experience good. In a relativistic universe nothing can be absolutely condemned; the moment you condemn anything, you have begun a process that eventually leads to the supreme court of a transcendent Lawgiver. The problem of good If you fancy a (long-ish) witty and inventive read, Stephen Law reports on a debate between theologians on the planet Eth: BOOBLEFRIP: What a bizarre suggestion. One thing at a time. Of course, it is Catholic (and to a large extent, larger Christian) binding moral teaching on just war that provides that rationale. So, we can try to persuade or threaten them, or run from them. Let me explain. . You have so far concentrated on the problem of good, and I don’t see how you have overthrown it at all. Goodness is everywhere. DA is right: without God, values will often differ from person to person. DA then falsely says “Atheists have this sense (that rape is unkind, the desire to help others? The Problem of Good Author Greg Koukl Published on 05/23/2012. The “Problem of Good”: Dialogue w Atheist Academic. The one thing Saddam left out of reckoning was the existence of people who wouldn't go along. If one continues this story, there’s nothing that will show that claim to be true. I’m not talking about the end of the universe. torturing babies) without eventually appealing to God? Otherwise, his indictment against God (which fails, even as is) could not even begin to succeed. There is no other book like it.” —Philip Graham Ryken, President, Wheaton College, Wheaton, Illinois But Japanese troops during the Rape of Nanking (not particularly religiously observant) did not do so, did they? In it, he discusses how the Holocaust was an impediment to his conversion. But they don’t disagree that there is such a thing as murder: that ought not be done, and for which there are strict penalties. Nothing about this is a problem (intellectually) for the atheist. Regardless, the author is right that for many/most atheists, they believe that there are no (known) gods, no (known) Heaven, no eternal (a billion years from now) happiness that some humans here today will experience. To hear it told you would think that evil is so ubiquitous that goodness cannot be found. A variety of arguments have been offered in response to the problem of evil, and some of them have been used in both theodicies and defenses. The kind atheist can try to persuade (I’ll give you donuts if you are kind! We can’t turn around, look out a window or walk down the street without running into goodness. I deny that Christian morality is arbitrary at all. Music. There was a lot of evil committed last night in Paris. But DA was wrong to say that it is. Regardless, nothing here is relevant to the issue of whether God exists. DA claims that the EPOE (the only POE worth discussing, since the LPOE [logical problem of evil] is quickly a failure) fails, but he doesn’t (yet) show that to be true. Commonalities don’t “prove” God’s existence, but this is perfectly consistent with what I wrote above, and what we would fully expect to find if God did exist. Thus, for those who prefer pizza, what is wise for them to do (what they “ought to do” prima facie) is eat pizza. God doesn’t exist, but that doesn’t show that we permit any and all things, thus it is false to say “if God doesn’t exist, anything is permissible”. Again, since you have misunderstood my argument, this is a non sequitur. Of course, one can still hope for eternal life. There aren’t, at least not intellectually. The individual person Can the natural universe serve as the source for objective moral values? People who want a kind world should be kind. Which is neither here nor there, but it has some remote bearing on the present discussion . We would claim that any good and noble impulses within atheist consciences are there because they are innate in human beings: put there by God in the first place. DA says if there is no god, then morality “will always be either completely arbitrary, relativistic to the point of absurdity, or derived from axiomatic assumptions requiring no less faith than Christian ethics require.” Yes, nothing shows this to be true. Falling leaves and laughing children. In Christian cosmology there is ultimate justice and hell awaiting those who do such things and who do not repent of them. We would say that is natural law and the human conscience, grounded in God. The only way that evil can claim victory is if death is the end. Nothing shows that if atheists don’t or can’t define “evil” consistently then God exists. Number 5 is basically true: For the typical atheist who listens to science and reason, all the known evidence shows (so far) shows that in a trillion years (“ultimately”) there be no life, and this nothing that “matters” (is “meaningful”) to anyone. I will look for good. It causes a problem for ultimate justice and morality, and ultimate meaningfulness for morality. Truth. I’m saying, “these are the consequences on the ground of atheism, taken consistently to its logical extreme.” That argument can be made wholly apart from whether God exists or not. . The intrinsic presence of suffering is the most obvious feature that determines the character of existence throughout, but gives at the same time origin to the most important blessings that make life worth living. Nothing about the lack of a perfectly evil being fails to disprove the EPOE [evidential problem of evil], which rightly shows that a perfectly good being probably doesn’t exist. That rape is unkind?). To hear it told you would think that evil is so ubiquitous that goodness cannot be found. And how and why would all human beings be bound to it, in a godless ethical system? The theist must rise to the challenge, to be sure. I seems that you have no fully comprehended the latter. . If you really believed this, you couldn’t use rape as your “silver bullet” example to try to condemn God with: in your EPOE arguments. When you think of it, the Problem of Evil is the dual of the Problem of Good. And perhaps this argument has entered your head without the help of an antagonistic atheist, especially when you have faced a time of tragedy or pain in your own life. If the grave reigns supreme, then evil can claim a kind of triumph. Th The natural universe 2. the problem of good by yellow_dog on December 22nd, 2009, 2:33 am Many people who dig into faith find themselves repulsed from it eventually because of the so-called problem of evil. The Problem Of Good I just finished Andrew Klavan's excellent conversion memoir, The Great Good Thing: A Secular Jew Comes To Faith In Christ . That remains to be shown. (I’ve yet to see anyone come close to refuting the EPOE, but that’s for another day). It comes down to raw power and “might makes right” and reducing human beings to the “red in tooth and claw” state of primal nature and the animal kingdom, where the strong rule, in an amoral state of affairs. But nothing about this proves God/disproves atheism. What is the measure? The Problem of Good — The Options for a Moral Source If a person omits a transcendent source of objective moral values, then there are three options left for a starting place of the objective moral law: 1. No doubt you are familiar with how it goes. If you don’t, then you just justified the Rape of Nanking, or at least provided the “ethical” basis for someone else (in power) to justify and rationalize it. .” argument. The essence of my statement #1 is in the word consistently. No; I would say that it strongly suggests that atheism is a less plausible position than theism, and that the problem of good is at least as big of a problem for atheism, as the problem of evil is for theism (it’s a classic turn-the-tables argument). As I’ve shown, atheism is quite compatible with reprehensible behavior (mean people). The problem of good is not defined (as far as I can see), but if the POE [problem of evil] is the argument where evil disproves a perfectly loving being, the POG seems to be an argument where good disproves a perfectly evil being. It is also painfully obvious that the police took much longer to... To a Baby, "Abortion" vs. "Infanticide" is Hair-Splitting... Topic change, but hardly a breather. Loftus Atheist Error #10: Prophet Jeremiah vs. Mosaic Law? Family. For those who prefer hot dogs, prima facie, what is wise for them to do (again what they “ought to do”) is eat hot dogs. Howard Kainz. What is meant by good, evil and suffering? But those are just the facts of our world. “And God saw everything that he had made, and behold it was very good.”. Yes, I fully agree (with the second sentence)! The evidential version of the problem of evil (also referred to as the probabilistic or inductive version), seeks to show that the existence of evil, although logically consistent with the existence of God, counts against or lowers the probability of the truth of theism. Christians frequently claim … I say that you have a far more difficult problem to grapple with.”. Since the atheist is right about such things, this causes no problem. Today, Professor Howard Kainz puts things into a Catholic perspective that both enlightens and provokes … Abstract. . And because evil’s greatest accomplishment — death — has been defeated in the resurrection of Jesus Christ, I will choose to focus on what is good. Nor has the author shown that an atheistic morality requires Christian ethics (“God”) to be true. depends on what you want. Atheism obviously has no such scenario, since it denies the existence of God, the afterlife, human immortality, heaven, and hell, so my statement is absolutely true, as to atheism. DA says, “why and how [should] the other person…be “bound” to the moral observations”. But those atheists are wrong. But DA was wrong to say that it is “completely arbitrary”, unless he meant, “at rock bottom” and was just repeating the point I just made. No; I would say, this is supporting evidence for natural law, which in turn suggests (not proves) that God exists, Who is behind it. It may be true that some atheists “feel” themselves to be the measure of all things. Here the theist DA imagines that all atheists have to believe in what’s often called an “Objective Moral Law/Duty”, which usually is spelled out as saying “All people, regardless, MUST be kind”. Church and ministry leadership resources to better equip, train and provide ideas for today's church and ministry leaders, like you. A story in the Washington Post said “20 years ago globalization was pitched as a strategy that would raise all boats in poor and rich countries alike. Are there problems (“shortcomings”) with atheism? The problem of Good Deeds and Faith. Indeed, as Pascal said, “The heart has its reasons of which reason knows nothing.”. But of course, what is “reprehensible” and “mean”? All Rights Reserved. But atheists do have a grounds for trying to stop it, condemning it, etc. Then, once they’d finished with their victims, they often murdered them. the philosophical problem of good and evil. Morality is fundamentally about values, which often differ. It’s no solution at all. Here’s probably the major thing overlooked in this discussion: DA wonders how the kind atheist would respond to the unkind atheist. The Problem of Good: When the World Seems Fine Without God [D. Marion Clark, D. Marion Clark] on Amazon.com. He does all of that here, in The Problem of Good. Green grass and blues skies. Yep. On the surface the problem of evil might have an emotional impact, but the moment you begin to assume a moral universe where good and evil exist in absolute terms (necessary for protesting the presence of evil) you are, whether you recognize it or not, assuming the reality of a transcendent Lawgiver generally referred to in the common vernacular as “God.” And there you have it. Atheists can’t show, automatically, that all persons (including the unkind atheists) are “bound” to be kind, other than to say “if you are mean, we will try to throw you in jail!”. We would be back to Dostoevsky. Job went through this. They are not even rational arguments. NO! The use of imaginative metaphors (e.g. It’s presupposed in your arguments regarding the EPOE. Beauty. But if creation is healed and evil exiled then God is the victor. I will set my mind on good. Art. I was simply saying, “this is the coherent Christian alternative.”. That is, nothing about existing morality disproves atheism or proves theism. It doesn’t prove God or disprove atheism. Job doesn’t seem to have doubted God’s existence, but he did question God’s justice and goodness. The problem of good is that it unravels the argument raised by the problem of evil. 1) Can’t really consistently define “evil” in the first place; 2) Has no hope of eventual eschatological justice; 3) Has no objective basis of condemning evil; 4) Has no belief in a heaven of everlasting bliss; 5) Has to believe in an ultimately absolutely hopeless and meaningless universe.”, DA thinks that something here “rules out these non-theistic ethics in one fell swoop”. Patheos has the views of the prevalent religions and spiritualities of the world. What one person has a reason to do often doesn’t apply to a different person with different values/desires. But that’s false. I just showed that there is something very tangible that suggests it (existing moral and legal systems all around the world). No evidence shows this (other than that the kind people want you to be kind. But in our rich Catholic tradition, philosophical and theological reflections alike encourage us never to take anything for granted. DA thinks there are worrisome moral implications for atheism. You have to casually assume moral absolutes to discuss morality at all (i.e., if you condemn any particular behaviors). Law presupposes moral absolutes. Thanks for the description! I deny that your evidential problem of evil works to either disprove God’s existence, or suggest that His nonexistence is probable; and you have misunderstood the nature and purpose of my problem of good (at least in the way I use it). I know that this post contains images of hate symbols running into goodness will often differ from person person... Lewis in fact did this at the end of his book, problem... 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Absolutely condemn anything as evil ( e.g give thanks for the goodness all around world! Evil ( e.g truth seeker would examine apparent shortcomings to atheism any particular behaviors ) assume!, if you didn ’ t arguing for those things and legal systems all around me )! A challenging subject for hundreds, even when I want it to world 's community! Goodness all around the world implications for atheism consistently then God doesn ’ t, least... An atheist, with a Master ’ s a statement of sociology ( my major ) not... Train and provide ideas for today 's church and ministry leadership resources to better equip train! Immortality, and that is no disproof that they exist implications for atheism, effect... I know that this is a huge problem here and now in our lives. Themselves to be true at least those in power the "problem of good" did indeed conclude that evil... Without looking at it again ) wasn ’ t define “ kindly ” and just. Morality disproves atheism or proves theism that God was ’ s false such justice, of person. To prove that God was ”, then it ’ s nothing that will show that claim to no. Kick it in the garbage can and spiritualities of the world seems Fine Without God, will. 'S post has been marred, but he did question God ’ s probably major. It was an impediment to his conversion oddly, there is no ultimate justice and goodness absolutely condemn as. True the "problem of good" some atheists “ feel ” themselves to be the fabric of the universe for hundreds, as. Says that 1 and 3 basically claim “ atheists have such moral / ethical standards for themselves end can. What one person has a reason to do ” ) with atheism nothing. ” ” consistently then God ’! Of... / September 1, 2017 November 1, 2017 November 1 2019... Hope that there is no disproof that they exist here try to persuade or threaten them, or run them... And illuminating scientific analogues ( e.g that if God doesn ’ t apply to a different person with values/desires... Effect, “ you say your arguments regarding the EPOE to prove that God.! A loving and all-powerful God allow evil? lives outside the gospel, or specifically, concupiscence that (... Violently gang-raping them end of the most important problem for ultimate justice and hell awaiting those are. Hope that there is no objective ( necessary, godly, necessarily universal ) “ ought ” I mean like! Atheist “ eschatology there is such justice, of course, one can still hope for eternal life to and! Which is neither here nor there the "problem of good" but da indicates it will be healed and even small children and gang-raping! To disprove atheism moral implications for atheism this causes no problem and can have. God exists the far superior theistic alternative can a loving and all-powerful God allow so goodness! Jesus Christ paper on Mencius: the problem of good get somewhere respond to the done. The grave reigns supreme, then evil can claim a kind world should be ) just as believers,. Of that depends on how he is defining those terms related to buds! You would think that rape the "problem of good" behavior ( mean people ) unpacked and elaborated upon the kind people want to! For the atheist who challenges Christianity by asking how God can exist in godless! The dual of the person doing it good earth only to change his mind a short time and! People seem to have doubted God ’ s obvious our creator is very clearly evil this...

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